rear alignment problem - Page 2 - Scion XB Forum
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post #11 of 30 (permalink) Old 05-16-2012, 12:21 AM
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Originally Posted by xBones View Post
Basically, when lowered, the beam pivots upward. This causes the factory negative camber to become positive toe. Replacing the beam will rarely fix the problem, and it WILL NOT fix it if you've got lowering springs.
thank you for chiming in xbones. your knowledge and experience is most welcome.

you stated lowering the box creates positive toe. i assume that this would be within an acceptable range because trd makes lowering springs specifically for our vehicle. lowering the box with trd springs should not throw it outside of the "green".

i'm no expert, it's just how i perceive it with my limited knowledge.

i have never tried the shim kits, but thru some research i discovered the moog kit would be the "best shot" at correcting this issue. indeed, it will take some level of "trial and error", "back and forth" when installing these shims. i can see why a dealership would not chose to invest that kind of time and effort with no guaranteed outcome. not to mention to tie up an alignment rack for who knows how long.

personally, i would be willing to give a shot if i hadn't got a new beam. my service director was willing to work with me and together i'm confident that we would have figured it out.

my axle beam was out specs before i lowered my box. i had lowering springs installed with the new beam and everything was tight. can't seem to locate that printout at the moment. i did have an alignment check in jan 2012 before a road trip. all "green" on nf210 springs. (see attach)

this thread started with an xB2 rear being out of specs lowered on trd springs. i'm confident we can come together and solve this issue for our fellow forum member. and have that solution available to others.
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post #12 of 30 (permalink) Old 05-16-2012, 01:53 PM
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when my rear end got rebuilt it passed with lowering springs (dfs) installed by the dealer. The same springs that were on it when it was first discovered that my first beam wasn't within spec.

RS 8 #72
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post #13 of 30 (permalink) Old 05-18-2012, 09:35 PM Thread Starter
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as a follow-up ,I had my Scion's rear re-aligned at the non-toyota dealership on Wed. Although it was a five hour wait (supposedly the shims took 2 hours to get there) I rec'd a before and after printout of the alignment and it is within the proper specs now.. I was perfectly happy until I read your replies. Now I have to worry about the bolt torque and the tire sensor being damaged, Guess I'll give it to hubby to double check everything. Thanks everybody!
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post #14 of 30 (permalink) Old 05-18-2012, 10:02 PM
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I don't have a printout of mine in front of me. I threw mine on my ancient Hunter machine right after it was calibrated. I had to tweak the front after a nasty pothole. Yeah yeah something bent probably but it was only .20 out so easier to put the toe back in.

My rear was like .10 and .23 L/R respectively. I'm on TRD springs. My wheel has always been a tad off due to the thrust angle being out of whack and it kinda drives me nuts. But it doesn't seem to be enough to wear tires. I'll check it from time to time to see if it changes as metal fatigues or parts wear to see if it's worth doing shims.
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post #15 of 30 (permalink) Old 05-18-2012, 11:43 PM
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it's good to hear the shim kit corrected your issue. my speculation is now confirmed! thanks for sharing. now get out there and enjoy your new toy!!!

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post #16 of 30 (permalink) Old 05-19-2012, 01:56 AM
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Now the shims are in there, I'm curious if they will effect brake pad wear.
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post #17 of 30 (permalink) Old 05-19-2012, 08:31 AM Thread Starter
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now I have to be concerned with brake wear too? you guys are freaking me out! Thanks for all the input fellas!
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post #18 of 30 (permalink) Old 05-19-2012, 06:13 PM
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conventional wisdom and simple laws of physics couldn't possibly connect adverse brake pad wear with alignment shims. brake pad wear is consistent with the rotational axis of the rotors not the shims. let her enjoy her success. she just manage to avoid a $2000 repair in exchange for 5 hrs of her time. congrats a1coolmom

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post #19 of 30 (permalink) Old 05-21-2012, 02:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erozcs View Post
conventional wisdom and simple laws of physics couldn't possibly connect adverse brake pad wear with alignment shims. brake pad wear is consistent with the rotational axis of the rotors not the shims. let her enjoy her success. she just manage to avoid a $2000 repair in exchange for 5 hrs of her time. congrats a1coolmom
Do you not know how the rotational axis of the rotors react with the angle of the hub and calipers themselves? Obviously not, otherwise you wouldn't have made that statement.
If you space the hub, and rotational axis of the rotors thereof, the way the brake pads engage the rotor will be affected.
Not sure if you have disassembled the rear of the xB2, but I have.

If you space the hub in any way, you will have to space the caliper as well. The hub, and inherently rotational axis of the rotors, are mounted on the same plane as the calipers. If any of these corresponding mounting points differ, abnormal brake wear will occur.
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post #20 of 30 (permalink) Old 05-21-2012, 08:33 PM
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i understand your concern and i see your point. i also apologize if my reply is perceived offensive. the brake calipers are self-adjusting by the use of the guide pins. when the piston engages the inner pad, the caliper will be pulled out and line-up with the rotor. if the shims are thicker than the travel of the guide pin, braking would be adversely affected. i have a set of these shim kits that i never used. they are alot thinner than the guide pin travel. now if the plane of the pads and the plane of the rotor are not exactly parellel, the pads will wear to parellel as long as the rotor is turning true. i believe this is an acceptable alternative to replacing the axle beam. her camber and toe is within specs. that wheel will turn true as soon as the pads wear parellel to the rotor. you are absolutely correct, the hubs will be pushed out of the normal position, the slight thickness of the shim. this could possibly lead to that inner pad wearing slightly faster than the outer. the difference would be minor and within acceptable limits.

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